[rczubaty]

Alright, i have an 03 Raptor 660 that has sat for oh, 9 years give or take a year. It ran with no real issues when it was parked. It had "bogged" at high RPM (hill climbing) on me a couple times but only a few times... in hindsight now maybe this was related.

Back in 03 i had bypassed the reverse limiter ( cutting a green wire and running it to negative battery post) and also there are wires near the key/handle bars on right (sitting on machine) that if i remember right were for a park brake or neutral switch... i have a black wire and black w/ yellow stripe connected together. and then 2 black wires individually taped up. Quad is piped (Looney tuned dual), jetted, proflow filter, sproket, custom airbox, and dynatek F.S. Digital Ignition CDI)

so forward to a week ago, did a bunch of maintenance to see if i can get it running ( oil, antifreeze, gas etc). went to try and start it and the fuse in the solenoid would blow as soon as key turned on. it would not blow with the kill switch engaged. so i replaced the solenoid. a note here about that. the stock one had 20a fuses, while the new one had 30a.

once i replaced the solenoid i turned the key, fuse blows immediately. this is when i found/remembered the cut wires near the handle bars. these connections are not great, cut, wires twisted and taped. i took off the old dirty dry tape, changed to fuse and turned the key. it didn't blow. so i assumed these connections were shorting somehow.

so i hit the start button, just a tap no fuel tank on the bike yet. it seemed like it would of started so i'm assuming i have to redo these connections and ill be good. but then before i turned the key off the red light (temp?) turned on and then boom CDI box blows, smokes and is clearly done. oh and the fuse in solenoid did not blow this time

what happened? the wires were shorting and blowing the fuse and a separate cdi issue once it received power? or another issue causing all of it? any insight would be much appreciated. i may have the stock cdi still but if i put it in is it going to release the factory smoke as well? what can i check/test. is there something better i can do with the "mods" i did 20 years ago? or just make better connections and leave as is?

sorry for the long winded post Thanks in Advance.

 

[rczubaty]

is there a better place to post this? Rather than modifications? no electrical board? i ordered another CDI box but would love to be more confident that it wont just blow up before i try it

 

[QuadManiac]

You're in the right place, but there is not much we can do yet...

Your wiring is modified and we have NO way of guessing what is going on without having access to your quad. Go through the wiring harness metiulously, returning to stock, if necessary, and looking for breaks, chafes, shorts, etc. (this is very common around the battery)

Only you are going to be able to find this.

You obviously have at least one wire or pair of wires that are shorting together or to ground... it is extremely difficult to blow up a CDI. By 'kill switch engaged' do you mean in the OFF position? This switch is just main power to the CDI so if the problem always ocurred when the switch was ON, I'd look for chafing/shorts in wires that lead to/from the CDI.

What led you to replace the solenoid? Anything electricl could blow the fuse. Also, NEVER replace a fuse with a larger than designed for value. Its job is to protect from damage and a larger one invites damage!

BTW temp light is supposed to come on while pressing the start button as a bulb test.

Attached is the wiring diagram. Study, learn and ask questions if you need to - it IS your friend!

 

[rczubaty]

You're in the right place, but there is not much we can do yet...

Your wiring is modified and we have NO way of guessing what is going on without having access to your quad. Go through the wiring harness metiulously, returning to stock, if necessary, and looking for breaks, chafes, shorts, etc. (this is very common around the battery)

Only you are going to be able to find this.

You obviously have at least one wire or pair of wires that are shorting together or to ground... it is extremely difficult to blow up a CDI. By 'kill switch engaged' do you mean in the OFF position? This switch is just main power to the CDI so if the problem always ocurred when the switch was ON, I'd look for chafing/shorts in wires that lead to/from the CDI.

What led you to replace the solenoid? Anything electricl could blow the fuse. Also, NEVER replace a fuse with a larger than designed for value. Its job is to protect from damage and a larger one invites damage!

BTW temp light is supposed to come on while pressing the start button as a bulb test.

Attached is the wiring diagram. Study, learn and ask questions if you need to - it IS your friend!

Thanks for the reply, the only mods I found are the reverse rev limiter override - green/white wire cut at connector by fuel tank pet cock, pin removed from connector and green/white connected to a wire running to negative post of battery.

then the wires under the handle bars (park brake) there is a black wire and black with yellow stripe (both of these come out of the same “tube”) these two are tied together. In the same location there are 2 black wires (in the same “tube”) that are cut off and not connected to anything.

I looked over the wiring when the fuses were blowing and didn’t notice anything other than the above mentioned that had any bare wire. I’ve since re done the connections as I found them (the quad ram for years before parked). This is why I replaced the solenoid, I couldn’t find any shorts/breaks, so after reading on these forums or similar I thought the solenoid was an affordable component to try and replace especially since it sat without being used for so long.

the temp light… it wasn’t turning on when I hit thestart button, or at least I didn’t notice, but it lit up continually as the CDI box smoked and blew up. And yes for the kill switch, when it’s in “off” position the fuse was not blowing, but in “run” the fusewould blow with key turning on.

Also the 30a fuses have been replaced with 20a.

I will look over the wires near the battery once again for any short. If I don’t see anything, would you put thisnew CDI in? I really don’t want to blow up another one.

I suppose it is possible that the connections on the “mods” were shorting as they were just twisted together and poorly taped, that and the solenoid are really all I’ve changed.

that CDI that blew did sit without running for 9 years. I am not an electrical guy by any means..

 

[rczubaty]

It literally blew/melted a hole in the CDI box

 

[QuadManiac]

Before plugging in a new CDI I would measure voltage on every CDI connector pin and also measure continuity from every pin to ground and to other pins... using the wiring diagram as reference to determine what makes sense. If something seems out of the ordinary investigate prior to CDI install.

 

[rczubaty]

Before plugging in a new CDI I would measure voltage on every CDI connector pin and also measure continuity from every pin to ground and to other pins... using the wiring diagram as reference to determine what makes sense. If something seems out of the ordinary investigate prior to CDI install.

Ok thanks again, I think I can manage that. I am a little “scared” to plug this new one in, so this should relieve some of that.

 

[rczubaty]

Ok thanks again, I think I can manage that. I am a little “scared” to plug this new one in, so this should relieve some of that.

I have some data now, but I’m not sure what these numbers are supposed to look like…

clip “1” white/green, white/red, red
Black, orange, yellow/black, red/black
I have 12.14v on yellow/black.
For continuity to ground (negative battery post) I have 001 on black and orange, 37 on red/black and no reading on the other 4 wires (meter reads 1 and stays on 1)

clip “2”. Green/yellow, black/yellow
Green/white, blue
i have 0.6v on blue.
continuity to ground 001 on green/white, 12 on blue and 3 on black/yellow. No reading on green/yellow.

clip”3”. Green/blue
White, blue/yellow
I have 12.56v on green/blue

continuity to ground 94 on green no reading on the other two.

now…. My multimeter has a little >+ symbol that the manual says to use for continuity, which I did and it seemed to be working when checking to ground. When I started checking between pins I noticed something I can’t explain.. on clip “1” with my black meter probe (com) on the black wire pin and red prob (Ω) on the yellow/black wire pin I get no reading (meter displays and remains on 1) but when I switch the probes ( black probe on black/yellow & red probe on black) it reads 772. How is/is this possible?? I repeated this several times with the same results…. Am I doing something wrong? How can there be resistance one way and not the other?

so I check across a fuse with black prob (com) and red prob (Ω) and set on the >+ symbol as per manual my meter displays 1. When I connect probes to the fuse it goes to 0 this is the same regardless of which probe goes where ( makes sense). If I set the meter to 200Ω rather than the >+ symbol it reads .3 across the fuse regardless of which probe. The pins reading resistance one way and nothing with probes reversed made me question if I was testing correctly… thanks in advance for any more tips or next steps.

 

[QuadManiac]

1) there is no Green... only green/white and green/yellow. With no CDI plugged in, 12V on either of these is BAD! "I have 12.56v on green" I'm going to assume this is green/white and, somehow, it has been connected to battery PLUS instead of battery minus as it is supposed to be for Reverse RPM limit disable. This could fry a CDI! Trace this one out and find where it is mis-connected.

2) I assume these measurements were also made with no CDI attached, correct? If so, yellow/black should NOT have 12V on it... try unplugging the connector from the solenoid and retry.

3) Use Ohms when measuring continuity. The 'continuity' measurement setting of your meter introduces unknown variables into the measurement that I can't decipher remotely - this is likely one cause of your measurement chage when swapping leads. Also, with battery connected, voltage on any wires can cause resistance measurement errors - another cause of lead swap strangeness. Disconnect the battery positive terminal to measure Ohms in the harness.


BTW, your 03 has the same wire colorsas the diagram but different CDI connector pinout - learn here:

The differences between 01 and 02 CDI wiring explained

Many people have asked about the differences between 01 and 02+ CDI wiring. Some have had issues with wrong/mismatched CDI/wiring harness years. I have been trying to resolve this issue and with help from others here, I believe that I finally have an answer. I originally posted part of this...

www.raptorforum.com

Here's the pinout of yours looking down at backside where wires enter connector:

 

[rczubaty]

1) there is no Green... only green/white and green/yellow. With no CDI plugged in, 12V on either of these is BAD! "I have 12.56v on green" I'm going to assume this is green/white and, somehow, it has been connected to battery PLUS instead of battery minus as it is supposed to be for Reverse RPM limit disable. This could fry a CDI! Trace this one out and find where it is mis-connected.

2) I assume these measurements were also made with no CDI attached, correct? If so, yellow/black should NOT have 12V on it... try unplugging the connector from the solenoid and retry.

3) Use Ohms when measuring continuity. The 'continuity' measurement setting of your meter introduces unknown variables into the measurement that I can't decipher remotely - this is likely one cause of your measurement chage when swapping leads. Also, with battery connected, voltage on any wires can cause resistance measurement errors - another cause of lead swap strangeness. Disconnect the battery positive terminal to measure Ohms in the harness.


BTW, your 03 has the same wire colorsas the diagram but different CDI connector pinout - learn here:

The differences between 01 and 02 CDI wiring explained

Many people have asked about the differences between 01 and 02+ CDI wiring. Some have had issues with wrong/mismatched CDI/wiring harness years. I have been trying to resolve this issue and with help from others here, I believe that I finally have an answer. I originally posted part of this...

www.raptorforum.com

Here's the pinout of yours looking down at backside where wires enter connector:

View attachment 143047
View attachment 143048

Sorry it is green/blue (I missed the stripe) that had 12.56v o just double checked and got 12.6. Yes all measurements taken without CDI (on the clips that it would plug into). And key turned on.

Yellow/black does indeed still have 12.25v even after I disconnected from the solenoid and tried again.

I also did the continuity check over (with positive battery cable disconnected from
Battery ) and on the 200ohm setting rather than the symbol.

to ground (negative battery post) I get:
.5 black
.5 orange
40.7 red/black
.5 black/yellow
.6 green/white
9.5 blue
All others had no reading

For between pins
Black-orange .7
Black-red/black 40.7
Black-green/white .5
Black-blue 9.2
Black-black/yellow .6

white/green- red .7

red/black- blue 83.6
Red/black- green/white 92.2
Red/black -black/yellow 91.1
All others had no reading.
Something strange about the last 3, when I first tested them I got numbers in the 40s, then I retested these after I had disconnected the solenoid and was rechecking the voltages.

so it seems I have at least one problem with have 12v on yellow/black with no CDI installed?

 

[rczubaty]

On this last check I also noticed a tiny break in the wire insulation on the green/yellow wire about 1.5” from the CDI plug

 

[QuadManiac]

Green/blue should have 12V (looking through the reverse bulb)... The yellow/black should not.

With key on and run/stop in run, red/black will be tied back to many other circuits... and red should be connected to red/black - why is yelow/nlack too? Check it for 12V both with solenoid connector plugged in and unplugged. (with battery connected)

Yellow/black having 12V is what bothers me the most!

 

[rczubaty]

the green/yellow wire doesn't seem damaged, juts a small crack in the insulation, I've taped it. is that good enough? cant get a shrink tube on because of the connectors.

I checked all the wiring over again ( without removing the "sleeve" from the main harness/ group of wires. i assume its not likely something inside this is damaged as there is no visible damage to the outside... do i need to remove this and check more thoroughly?

Green/blue should have 12V (looking through the reverse bulb)... The yellow/black should not.

With key on and run/stop in run, red/black will be tied back to many other circuits... and red should be connected to red/black - why is yelow/nlack too? Check it for 12V both with solenoid connector plugged in and unplugged. (with battery connected)

Yellow/black having 12V is what bothers me the most!

i was literally just rereading this thread and about to have another look at this thing. To confirm, you’re saying check yellow/black again both connected to and not connected to the solenoid? Will do asap.

 

[rczubaty]

Green/blue should have 12V (looking through the reverse bulb)... The yellow/black should not.

With key on and run/stop in run, red/black will be tied back to many other circuits... and red should be connected to red/black - why is yelow/nlack too? Check it for 12V both with solenoid connector plugged in and unplugged. (with battery connected)

Yellow/black having 12V is what bothers me the most!

12.38 on yellow/black with solenoid connected
0 with the clip removed from solenoid

EDIT To Add maybe irrelevant but with the clip removed from the solenoid there is also 0 on green/blue (12.45 connected to solenoid) and 0 on Blue(0.6 connected to solenoid)

with solenoid reconnected and run switch to stop/ off yellowblack loses its power while blue and green/blue still have voltage

 

[QuadManiac]

The colors you describe are confusing me... here are the solenoid connections:

Should be RED, BLUE/BLACK and YELLOW/BLACK... can you explain your colors?

 

[rczubaty]

The colors you describe are confusing me... here are the solenoid connections:

View attachment 143056


Should be RED, BLUE/BLACK and YELLOW/BLACK... can you explain your colors?

Sorry for the confusion. So I checked again the 3 clips that will connect to the CDI for voltage, i then removed the clip from the solenoid and checked those 3 clips that go to CDI again. The.n I reconnected the solenoid and put the “kill switch” to off and checked this 3 clips again. That’s what I was trying to describe in my last response.

I realize now that maybe I should of been checking for voltage ON the pins in the clip I removed from the solenoid?

 

[rczubaty]

The colors you describe are confusing me... here are the solenoid connections:

View attachment 143056


Should be RED, BLUE/BLACK and YELLOW/BLACK... can you explain your colors?

So, I removed the loom and tape from the solenoid wires(red, blue/black, yellow black) to check for any short. I also tried the original oem solenoid. And still have over 12 volt at the CDI plug on yellow/black.

I’d you are certain yellow/black shouldn’t have power… that wire is only like 10” long from CDI clip to solenoid clip and of course has no power when the clip is pulled from the solenoid. I don’t get where the power is coming from. But the kill switch being set to OFF it reads 0

 

[QuadManiac]

Key on, run/stop in run. Battery connected.

Pull the connector from the solenoid and look at voltage on the blue/black wire's pin in the connector you unplugged (what is it)... also look at voltage on that same pin ON the solenoid where the connector was plugged while it is unplugged (where blue/black wire would connect to if the connector was plugged in)

ALSO, look at the drawing of the solenoid connector in the wiring diagram and verify that your wires are in the proper locations in the connector.

Yellow/black goes from CD to one side of the solenoid's coil. The CDI will apply 12V to yellow/black if it deems the quad safe to start - key on, run/stop in run, in neutral or clutch pulled... That is the ONLY way y/b should have 12V on it.

The other end of the solenoid's coil goes through blue/black to the start button - which simply shorts blue/black to ground when pressed... if y/b has 12V across the solenoid coil and blue/black, the other end of the coil, gets shoted to ground so the coil is energized, becomes an electro-magnet and slams the solenoid contacts closed so the starter is conected to battery.

If blue/black is somehow shorted to 12V somewhere, then, with no CDI, yellow/black would be pulled to 12V through the solenoid coil (as you see it) and a fuse would blow when you press the start button... cuz you're shorting 12V to ground through blue/black to the start button. Is this perhaps what we're seeing?

BTW, y/b goes to 0V when run/stop is at stop so if blue/black IS shorted to 12V somewhere it will only (likely) be to the red/black, perhaps at the handlebars where all those switches reside in the same housing or even maybe to white/blue somewhere else in the harness?

 

[rczubaty]

The colors you describe are confusing me... here are the solenoid connections:

View attachment 143056


Should be RED, BLUE/BLACK and YELLOW/BLACK... can you explain your colors?

So, I removed the

Key on, run/stop in run. Battery connected.

Pull the connector from the solenoid and look at voltage on the blue/black wire's pin in the connector you unplugged (what is it)... also look at voltage on that same pin ON the solenoid where the connector was plugged while it is unplugged (where blue/black wire would connect to if the connector was plugged in)

ALSO, look at the drawing of the solenoid connector in the wiring diagram and verify that your wires are in the proper locations in the connector.

Yellow/black goes from CD to one side of the solenoid's coil. The CDI will apply 12V to yellow/black if it deems the quad safe to start - key on, run/stop in run, in neutral or clutch pulled... That is the ONLY way y/b should have 12V on it.

The other end of the solenoid's coil goes through blue/black to the start button - which simply shorts blue/black to ground when pressed... if y/b has 12V across the solenoid coil and blue/black, the other end of the coil, gets shoted to ground so the coil is energized, becomes an electro-magnet and slams the solenoid contacts closed so the starter is conected to battery.

If blue/black is somehow shorted to 12V somewhere, then, with no CDI, yellow/black would be pulled to 12V through the solenoid coil (as you see it) and a fuse would blow when you press the start button... cuz you're shorting 12V to ground through blue/black to the start button. Is this perhaps what we're seeing?

BTW, y/b goes to 0V when run/stop is at stop so if blue/black IS shorted to 12V somewhere it will only (likely) be to the red/black, perhaps at the handlebars where all those switches reside in the same housing or even maybe to white/blue somewhere else in the harness?

key on, run/stop to run:

the pins within the clip I remove from the solenoid all have 0.

the pins ON the solenoid red has 12.93, blue and Y/B have 0. I also noticed there is 4 pins IN the solenoid and 3 in the clip. The fourth pin seems connected to red in the solenoid and also has 13.93v. This looks the same as the oem solenoid.

the pins/wire colours in the clip removed from the solenoid match the drawing ( as I’m looking into the clip when unplugged)

the fuse would notblow without the CDI though? Correct? The starter does nothing when pressed as is (solenoid connected) except turns on the temp light on the bars.

now that I reconnected the clip to the solenoid.. the “backs” of the pins are accessible (no rubber grommet or what you’d call it) so I checked the voltage there, connected. Red 12.79, Y/B 12.37, blue 12.37. Only red keeps power here with the run switch to stop.

 

[QuadManiac]

There is a mystery as to how, with run/stop in run, 12V can magically appear on Blue/black and Yellow/black when plugged into solenoid yet BOTH sides of theconnection of BOTH signals have 0 when unplugged... This tells me just about without a doubt that either blue/black or yelow/black is shorted somehow/somewhere to red/black or another circuit connected to red/black... this is not correct - again, up near the switch cluster is where they both (Blue/blk and red/blk) reside.

Unplug battery, set key on, run/stop switch to run, then measure on unplugged solenoid connector the resistance from red wire to blue/black AND red to Yellow/black... this should tell us which wire is shorted. Then we can pull some tricks to narrow down where.