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There is often mis-interpretation of the needle clip position as well. Meaning some people say "i moved the needle down" meaning they moved the clip position down on the needle. Others will say "i moved the needle down" meaning they moved the needle clip position up, hence dropping the needle down. So as a guideline, the farther down in clip positions, the richer it is

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I just reread the thread and realized you're at 5000ft. The DJ recommendation for jetting would be way off. You said the mains made a difference so at this point I would work on getting the mains dialed in, then work on the needles.
 
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Discussion Starter #23
The dyno jet it did include jet instructions for different altitudes, currently I'm at 138 and 140, which is DJs recommendation for above 6k feet .

Just to reiterate, since this thread is getting long, I have 138 and 140 dj mains, 25 pilots, needle clip is in the fourth position from the top, I'm using the dj slide springs, I have a stock exhaust without a spark arrester, my airbox lid is gutted, I have a k&n air filter, and I live at 5125 feet.

I have a dj 136 main I can try, I also have stock 22.5 pilots and stock needles I could try if need be.

Currently, the quad has decent power, (comparing with my 660 grizzly, raptor is currently faster) but has a mid range stumble with popping that causes steady state riding to suck.

Hopefully that keeps everyone on the same page. I really can't wait to get this thing dialed in right, and I appreciate the help


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Discussion Starter #24
I'm not sure if this matters or not, but I was just thinking about it, and currently the stumble is done soft Popping you can feel and hear, and it only happens when I'm maintaining a steady speed, not during acceleration.

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The dyno jet it did include jet instructions for different altitudes, currently I'm at 138 and 140, which is DJs recommendation for above 6k feet .

Just to reiterate, since this thread is getting long, I have 138 and 140 dj mains, 25 pilots, needle clip is in the fourth position from the top, I'm using the dj slide springs, I have a stock exhaust without a spark arrester, my airbox lid is gutted, I have a k&n air filter, and I live at 5125 feet.

I have a dj 136 main I can try, I also have stock 22.5 pilots and stock needles I could try if need be.

Currently, the quad has decent power, (comparing with my 660 grizzly, raptor is currently faster) but has a mid range stumble with popping that causes steady state riding to suck.

Hopefully that keeps everyone on the same page. I really can't wait to get this thing dialed in right, and I appreciate the help


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Keep the 25 pilots, I know that.
Popping will usually indicate lean along with a clean (white) spark plug.
Blub-blub-blubbing will indicate rich along with a dark (black) spark plug.

Other then that;
I don't know what's in the DJ kit.
I don't have or work on 660's.
I'm just going by jetting in general.
I would lean top end one more size and then work on the needles.

4Stroker, QuadManiac or T-Web may have some better insight.
 

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1 - how far onto throttle is this stumble?
2 - at sea level with open airbox you should be at DJ 146L/148R mains. At 5000 ft I'd drop 2 steps each to 142L/144R. I would try the DJ needles 1 notch lean of center.

Simple test:

1-Find exactly where in throttle position your stumble is... Between 0 and 1/4 throttle is the pilot jets; 1/4 to 3/4 is the needles and 3/4 to wide open is the mains

2-Now, turn off the fuel petcock.and ride at that throttle position. For a short while does the stumble get better? Then that throttle circuit is set too rich. If it just keeps getting worse, it is set up too lean.

Once you've done both tests you should have a good handle on how to proceed.
 

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Discussion Starter #27
The stumble seems to be between quarter and half throttle.

I'm surprised to hear you saying I should be a few Jets richer. I only have an open airbox, no exhaust or anything like that.

I'm planning on reading the plug, but need a new one first. The old one is black, but that was with a closed airbox and 160 and 165 mains.

I'll try the test you outlined, but it may be a bit before I get a chance.



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Discussion Starter #28
Alright, grabbed a few spark plugs and did a test at idle, mid range, and wot.

Oddly, all three are looking a nice light brown.

Seems like my stumble is right at the transition at 1/4 throttle. Only gives little occasional pops when I'm giving very little constant throttle, almost right between decelerating and accelerating while maintaining a constant speed. I can hear and feel the little pops when they happen in the power delivery.

At this point, I'm starting to think it's just decel popping that im not accustomed to. My other 660 is a grizzly, and the cvt acts a lot different.

Any merit to my thoughts?

Note that I didn't have new spark plugs, I was using cleaned and gapped plugs for the test


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Did you turn off the fuel and ride like QuadManiac said?

Just to verify, you have #25 pilots?

Take a magnifying glass and look down (actually up) inside at the insulator. You will want to see a golden brown ring around the top of the insulator. Sometimes the plug will have to be cut apart to see this. Unfortunately this won't show where the stumble is. The key is to be persistent and try different needle positions and jets. Keep track of each change and if it's better or worse.

QuadManiac may have better ideas as he knows more about 660's then I do.
 

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Discussion Starter #30
Yes I have 25 pilots.

I did shut off the fuel, just acted like it was running out of fuel.

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Discussion Starter #31
So, maybe I'm not communicating the issue right. Here's a quick video I took, should be able to hear the issue, although I don't think I turned the choke on enough to make a difference.


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Dezparado, I am test riding it. Revving in the shop don't tell much in my experience.
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I'm going out on a limb here, but spend $10 on a new spark plug, not a sandblasted one.
 
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Discussion Starter #33
Well I'm dumb. I was making it Leaner step by step until it wasn't running for crap. Decided to try 142 and 144 Jets with the clip one notch lean, and now it's running awesome. I even swapped the coil from my grizz to the raptor just to be sure. Made no difference.

New plug will go in after I fix the coolant leak, and then time to throw the paddles on and hit the dunes.

Thanks for the help on this project. Real excited to have it running right.

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Looks like QuadManiac was right again. We like it when a plan comes together. Thanks for the update.
The question now is, are your dunes at 5000ft or will you have to tune again?
 
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I just don't understand why people don't listen to me sooner! ;-}

Honestly, glad you got it running well!
 

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I just don't understand why people don't listen to me sooner! ;-}

Honestly, glad you got it running well!
Me to. I have to ask, "did you do my suggestions?". It's like pulling teeth to get anything out of some!
 

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Thanks
 

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Discussion Starter #38
I'm glad I tried your jetting suggestions, got me out of my own head.

I ride the raptor at the Little Sahara sand dunes that are about 30 miles away from me, and they are at 5000 feet, but I keep my grizzly setup for higher elevation, because the Arapeen trail system is about 30 miles in the other direction, and 10k feet is not unheard of there.

I likely won't take the raptor on the arapeen, so I don't think I'll need to jet it for higher elevation.

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I'm glad I tried your jetting suggestions, got me out of my own head.

I ride the raptor at the Little Sahara sand dunes that are about 30 miles away from me, and they are at 5000 feet, but I keep my grizzly setup for higher elevation, because the Arapeen trail system is about 30 miles in the other direction, and 10k feet is not unheard of there.

I likely won't take the raptor on the arapeen, so I don't think I'll need to jet it for higher elevation.

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Is this utah? I ride at little sahara OK sometimes...

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