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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Looking to build a Glamis (mild) Hill shooter, Looking for more the sensation and thrill of speed than competition. If anyone has had the chance to run a turbo and a similar HP all motor, how do they compare? What is more thrilling or feels faster?

I have a 2009 Turbo RZR s. When I went turbo the power is good, but it is a different sensation that lacks the "off the bottom torque".

Raptor 700 options:

A) 8mm stroker crank, 105 mm piston, 54 mm TB, Head ect

B) Turbo Kit of equal Hp

I want to get rocked by this quad, in the 3,500+/- Build range. Sometimes slower can Feel Faster?
 

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I've seen, ridden, raced, etc pretty much every turbo builder that stays up to date on the forums. Turbos are great, but they take about 15% more power to be the speed of a N/A motor. Obviously by my avatar I'm very pro turbo, and have spent alot of money on motors, turbo setups, turbos etc trying different stuff... maybe one reason I rarely ride my bike :D

Racing up Olds there's a ton of roof for a turbo to really pull through... like most say, the longer the hill, the better the turbo bikes will do.

Haveing said that, I do believe for 3500 bones you can have about the same speed N/A bike or turbo bike, but what's great about the turbo setup is the reliability on a stock motor.

Turbo Pros:
Virtually unlimited horsepower, you will break stuff in the motor before you reach it's limits.
Bolt on kit, don't even need to touch a head bolt
Turbos are way cooler :D
Adjustability to go from pump gas to race gas at a flick of a switch
Turbos are way cooler

Turbo Cons:
Initial Cost
Off the throttle snap (Nsane kits have intense torque, but still haven't seen a turbo kit with "snap")
Turbo Life
Virtually unlimited horsepower, you will break stuff in the motor before you reach it's limits :lol:
Horsepower dependant on load.

Motor Build Pros
You can do it over time
N/A builds are still pretty much the fastest bikes, until more Turbo bikes come into competition instead of local hill bragging, which will most likely change this year.
There are proven reliable setups for all motor builds
Tons of tech support from different companies instead of relying on just one.
Drag pipes are freakin cool

Motor Build Cons
85+Horsepower and you're losing the reliability aspect
85+Horsepower keeping the drivetrain together gets tricky, sprockets, tranny, etc. They're just brutal off the line.
Race gas can get expensive at $22 a gallon if you ride alot
You're modifying the internal components of the engine, alot more work.

These are just off the type of my head. I love turbo bikes and think they have even more potential left. I went with NSane turbos because that's who I felt the most comfortable with after doing my own turbo junk and watching the other builders over the years. Though D7 are awesome guys, English has wicked quick bikes and very nice, And Impulse's bike is extremely fast as well. If you're going for a fast duner/hillshooter a turbo setup is awesome, though 75% of the turbo bikes at the Oregon Rally broke... but most of those were from experimental 120+hp turbo bikes lol. 90hp turbos bikes are a blast, and an 80hp N/A bike screams.

As far as building an N/A motor, it has alot more to do with the combination of the parts than the actual size of the engine... when you see a SB/SS going 75mph up olds you'll see why :lol:

I hope I didn't confuse you, but that's just my take on it.

P.s. We have a pretty good size that goes to Glamis, always alot of good smack talking and hillshooting, I'm sure we'll start a gathering thread for halloween or Thanksgiving if you would like to join :)

p.p.s. If you hang out with us, you'll end up spending too much money, get out while you can! :lol:
 

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I've seen, ridden, raced, etc pretty much every turbo builder that stays up to date on the forums. Turbos are great, but they take about 15% more power to be the speed of a N/A motor. Obviously by my avatar I'm very pro turbo, and have spent alot of money on motors, turbo setups, turbos etc trying different stuff... maybe one reason I rarely ride my bike :D

Racing up Olds there's a ton of roof for a turbo to really pull through... like most say, the longer the hill, the better the turbo bikes will do.

Haveing said that, I do believe for 3500 bones you can have about the same speed N/A bike or turbo bike, but what's great about the turbo setup is the reliability on a stock motor.

Turbo Pros:
Virtually unlimited horsepower, you will break stuff in the motor before you reach it's u limits.
Bolt on kit, don't even need to touch a head bolt
Turbos are way cooler :D
Adjustability to go from pump gas to race gas at a flick of a switch
Turbos are way cooler

Turbo Cons:
Initial Cost
Off the throttle snap (Nsane kits have intense torque, but still haven't seen a turbo kit with "snap")
Turbo Life
Virtually unlimited horsepower, you will break stuff in the motor before you reach it's limits :lol:
Horsepower dependant on load.

Motor Build Pros
You can do it over time
N/A builds are still pretty much the fastest bikes, until more Turbo bikes come into competition instead of local hill bragging, which will most likely change this year.
There are proven reliable setups for all motor builds
Tons of tech support from different companies instead of relying on just one.
Drag pipes are freakin cool

Motor Build Cons
85+Horsepower and you're losing the reliability aspect
85+Horsepower keeping the drivetrain together gets tricky, sprockets, tranny, etc. They're just brutal off the line.
Race gas can get expensive at $22 a gallon if you ride alot
You're modifying the internal components of the engine, alot more work.

These are just off the type of my head. I love turbo bikes and think they have even more potential left. I went with NSane turbos because that's who I felt the most comfortable with after doing my own turbo junk and watching the other builders over the years. Though D7 are awesome guys, English has wicked quick bikes and very nice, And Impulse's bike is extremely fast as well. If you're going for a fast duner/hillshooter a turbo setup is awesome, though 75% of the turbo bikes at the Oregon Rally broke... but most of those were from experimental 120+hp turbo bikes lol. 90hp turbos bikes are a blast, and an 80hp N/A bike screams.

As far as building an N/A motor, it has alot more to do with the combination of the parts than the actual size of the engine... when you see a SB/SS going 75mph up olds you'll see why :lol:

I hope I didn't confuse you, but that's just my take on it.

P.s. We have a pretty good size that goes to Glamis, always alot of good smack talking and hillshooting, I'm sure we'll start a gathering thread for halloween or Thanksgiving if you would like to join :)

p.p.s. If you hang out with us, you'll end up spending too much money, get out while you can! :lol:



Nice post pw, I had to get a snack half way through but good info!
 

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From The Stix 2 Da Brix
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Never rode a turbo bike. I bet it'd be a blast though.
 

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you could even put an r1/r6 motor in there and leave it stock. it will be super fast and reliable.
 

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Isn't a good turbo system about 5,000? So that might be over budget. I would think the motor work might be better now and see how you like it and then you could do a turbo later if you needed to. By then you would have a killer bike with the motor work and a turbo.
 

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ER Stage ll Turbo is $3100 and Stage lll Turbo is a little over at $3950.
O ok, I saw a post a few weeks ago of a guy selling turbos for $5,000.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
A few questions for the D7 crew, on another thread you indicated you had some problem with your bike at Raptor Rally ?

"Example we took our dune/hill Turbo Raptor to Raptor Rally. (had a great time bty) And got our azz handed to us by English. This was a quad that was running mid 80's going up a steep hill at 4500ft.
Could not get it to move in Oregon on flat ground. Set up is everything. "

What was the problem?

From my RZRs turbo I learned that one fuel map or curve does not work for every machine at every location. This was a source of frustration for me with my RZR and " I was the only one with the problem". Aerocharger runs a box just like D7 and the only way to change the fuel curve is to send the unit back to the shop for a download (besides the buttons). Well, aerocharger only had one program for my application and it did not work, had to replace the the fuel controller and third injector with one from attitude industrie ($500)

Do you have any Turbo D7 bikes that run Glamis?
I would hate to get my azz stomped due to bad fuel tune that is perfect someplace else. Don't take this the wrong way, just a little concerned.

Is the "oil less" (Self contained) turbo ready for Kit production or still in testing? What price range is that in?
 

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Vendor - Rip Ass Connoisseur & Turbo Junkie
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Well first and foremost PW's analogy is fairly close...........except for a few miss guided comments.

#1 - 75% of the turbo bikes were broken? Name them? I lost a stator but still went out and rode!!! NOT turbo related, Kosta had an electrical problem as well......NOT a turbo problem. He still rode his quad all weekend.

#2 - PW ya know I Dig ya dude and your great on the NA stuff but I have yet to see you produce anything with a turbo that runs....so I would say your not an expert on turbo stuff. Not that you claimed to be, but you have a following and some people actually listen to you!!!:banghead:
Thats why we were trying to get you on a D7 Bike so you could finally go out and ride...........and have fun.

#3 Pimp dog we got are AZZ handed to us because we were not set up properly....not even close, it wasnt the Turbo it was all suspension, our fault for not doing our homework and being prepaired. Our bike was set up to race up Sand Mountain Nevada and not basically a flat drag. Again this isnt a turbo problem this was a +4 swingarm problem with small tires!!! OUR BAD!!!

#4 a 400 kit is just that........you get what you pay for for the most part.

#5 all the Turbo venders build good kits, US (D7 Racing), English Racing, Extreme Motorworks, and some others all build reliable kits. We at D7 dont offer any kind of stages or levels of turbo set up, you call us 775-771-6900 me or Bob at 775-742-2005 and we talk about the riding you do, what you have, where you want to be and give you all the options available to you. We as well as the other builders will build to your needs.

Going turbo is awesome, reliable and fast. Below is a link to some of our quads and customers quads, this is a very small sampling but you'll get the idea!!

http://s1086.photobucket.com/albums/j449/mpouellette/D7 Racing Quads/

Thanks for your interest in Turbo Quads and good luck!!

Mike
 

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I have to say I'm a big fan of both NA and turbo bikes, if I had enough money I would have both:) To me I like the fact that I can cruise around at low boost and be able to crank it up when needed to race. Also a good blow off valve is cool enough by itself! Not to mention at places like Idaho where your a 5k feet your not going to loose power like a NA bike.

We have only one kit that comes complete with a fuel stand alone, no tuning required, no matter what boost,temp,fuel, elevation etc. Also by the end of August we will have our new stand alone that comes complete with timing control, stutter button and a switch to switch between maps and more:D. So you could have a pump gas map and then a race fuel map for example. The system has worked great on the sleds all year and its nice to know your always running right and no need to tune for engine mods etc. We are expensive at 5500 bucks. But the kits comes with garret ball bearing turbo, tial housing/blow off and wastegate, dual injector, stand alone etc. Well thats my best salesman impression ;) No bad kits out there, just different ways of doing it.



 

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I was one of the broken bikes PW was talking about and it was turbo related, to much power from the turbo blew up my stock trans:D
 

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Shredder770= the New JVR. Our turbos kits are the best, your sucks, we produced awesome power with awesome reliability and can do anything
 

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Vendor - Rip Ass Connoisseur & Turbo Junkie
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Let's see who's bike's broke. Yours did, Kosta's did, Bob's lost a head gasket, English's Duner and Drag bike, Justin's Nsane bike... that's alot of breakage. And I don't spend all my time and money on my bike, sometimes I wish I did. I'm very down with the D7 crew, and Bob knows that, but when you start slandering me when I thought we were cool I take offense to it. You guys can claim you're the cats meow all you want, I haven't seen a fast D7 bike yet, and I don't just hang out on my single hill... I try to go everywhere I can. Glamis, Dumont, Oregon, Pismo, and trying to shoot for Sand Mountain. I've seen 4 D7 kits actually Run, and I've seen them beat by relatively low horsepower bikes. I know 2 of them I spanked on Coops 75hp Duner (i'm sure I'll hear about head gaskets, setup, rider yadda yadda, the excuses get old)... but they're supposed to be 90+hp I thought? At least English is trying to compete, all you're doing Mike is beating your chest about how you guys are the BEST in turbos. Why don't you run yours bike in a race, or get away from your hill for once in a while? Nsane had an Oiless turbo from Comp for over a year, way before you guys have had one. And guess what, it FAILED, and now I'm on my second, Comp claimed the grease was bad and they got a new formula for it. George even had a D7 bike on the dyno, and with a perfect air fuel table it would @ 9psi it would only pull 69hp, a far cry from the claimed 92hp at the time.

You want to call me out so be it. Fine make me an enemy, I've been cool for years. I get you got into D7 to make Money, but fuck dude, sometimes turbos just aren't the best setups for certain circumstances. Don't be telling me that I have no say because I break stuff, how much shit have you broken Mike? When's the last time Bob's bike ran for over a few months? Shit happens, I've broken motor parts and turbo parts, are you saying you haven't? Quit trying to sell your product, once it's out there and people see it works it'll sell itself! And I appreciate the offer of you trying to get me going to the D7 side with a smokin deal for a turbo kit, and so I could represent, but [email protected] has never done me wrong, and he's been fighting for me to get my stuff nailed down, and that is why I am staying with him. All my failures have been from Comp Turbos as far as turbo failures go, never once had a problem with anything George had produced. You know what gave turbo raptors a bad name? D7 did. Just google it, you can search the whole web of other bikes beating "d7 turbo raptors". You don't see that about English, K&T, or Nsane.

Now back off my balls foo, come back when you actually go fast, maybe the next FSA race? I'll bet Lucas and Extreme will be there.

And if you think you lost to the English bike just because of setup alone, you're dreaming, I don't even need to see the race to know that. Your bike sure is pretty, but it ain't no race bike.

You guys keep trying to sell turbo kits, I'll remain an unbiased bystander for ALL turbo products and engine products. And you won't find me trying to make money off of people's ignorance
Must of struck a nerve or two Tony, wow dude you took what I was saying way out bounds, my point was we broke but it wasnt turbo related, there was another guy running around looking for a stator as well, he didnt have a turbo, but what the hell, lets lump him in with the turbo bikes too!!!! 78% failure rate

yes I'm saying if we would have had our homework done we would have given hime a race.....would we have won who knows but at least there would have been a race...........we lost fair and square.....no excuses.

Last but not least, I have never at any given time said my bike was a drag bike, at one time it was back in 2007 but those days are long gone. My bike is a super duner, and was built for one purpose.

You know everything I said was true, and yeah I think its sad that Your stuck where you are on your turbo bike, we talk to comp all the time and we are sending things back and forth as well, I personally dont thing your getting whats best for Tony, and as I said to you before you deserved better.

I dont need to beat my chest, we take care of our customers and potential customers the same way with respect and honesty, just like several other turbo vendors do on here.

So if ya got anything more to say give me a call my phone is always on.

Mike
 

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Vendor - Rip Ass Connoisseur & Turbo Junkie
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Shredder770= the New JVR. Our turbos kits are the best, your sucks, we produced awesome power with awesome reliability and can do anything
wow, name calling, Really? I call you a great N/A builder and I'm bashing you? Be a man and answer your phone Tony........

I've called 3 times and he wont answer, oh well.

I'm Out.
 

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Tony I did not read anything negitive in Mike post. Peeps banter and disagree at times that cool.

What you just pulled was just low and I thought of you as a friend. The negativity we get is always from competors or folks that have there minds set on there guy. That's fine but don't lie or bash others.

We have allot of turbo kits out there never once has a single customer came on the net and had a problem with us. Again the attacks come from people that have nothing better to do with there lives.

Let set a couple records steight as again we have to defend our product from opinions and negitive campaigns..

First the D7 turbo quads you speak of that you whooped up on at Glamis do you have proof....No....Why you never raced one...The guys you speak of our our friends. One by mistake did not install his intake correct and was loosing boost.

The other guy had a head gasket issue non related to the turbo. Rather a water leak.

Second the George thing. I won't hold back George is a lying pice of shit that can't make his own stuff run so he feels he needs to make up storys.
The quad in question was Robkd's old quad. A pump gas build on low boost.
The new owner took it to a local shop that as soon as they saw it call George to come down and throw some big words around.
The shop and George had no idea what they were looking at or what they were doing. How do I know that.......Because the guy called me a a few months later he never had a problem with the quad and was really happy with it. Telling me if his quad only makes 65 or so h/p he was happy because he was beating quads that were making 80 h/p.

I'm happy with our product and feel our customers are happy with us. Not sure how going to and racing all the different events is going to do for us. We don't build drag quads so we do go after the drag quad market.

I'm sorry you feel the way you do...............
 

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Talk is cheap...I still prefer proof. Videos don't lie. This video is around 1 year old. This is my son's Bob jr. quad when it was still 100% stock just our dual injector turbo kit running 14psi. At the time his quad was running high 60's to low 70's up this hill. @4500ft.
We ran this Raptor for 4 1/2 years not a single problem. It went to Glamis, Dumont , Pismo, Sand Mountain Nv. , Coo's , Winchester , Florance, & St. Anthonys more then once same tune.
To give some a rough idea a 80ish H/P NA Raptor set up will can run this same hill low 60's. It's a big hill....................................

Again our base dual injector that we sell to anyone.





 
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