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Discussion Starter #1
I recently installed a +3 TB, +1mm valves, beehive springs, ported head and a webcam 940. CT Racing did the work. I got it back together and there isn't a noticeable power gain, in fact I had to cut the fuel map down more than half way to get it running right. One would think I would have to add fuel not subtract it! Any ideas on what is going on?
It used to have a hot cam 3 and stock head and tb. It's an 06 with a HC piston. CT and curevo both sent me fuel maps prior to putting it back together and both were extremely too rich which was a red flag right away.
 

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I would double check your tps and make sure it calibrated properly. Check timing as well. Does it run good other than having low power?
 

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What size piston are you using? Any dyno around that you could have them do a tune?
 

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I recently installed a +3 TB, +1mm valves, beehive springs, ported head and a webcam 940. CT Racing did the work. I got it back together and there isn't a noticeable power gain, in fact I had to cut the fuel map down more than half way to get it running right. One would think I would have to add fuel not subtract it! Any ideas on what is going on?
It used to have a hot cam 3 and stock head and tb. It's an 06 with a HC piston. CT and curevo both sent me fuel maps prior to putting it back together and both were extremely too rich which was a red flag right away.
I would recheck the timing marks. Did you adjust on the "I" or the "T" marks?
Recheck your valve adjustment per cam instructions. With a cold motor.
Readjust your TPS using your PC5 software.
What exhaust do you have? Look in with a flashlight and run a semiflexible wire thru to the head feeling for obstructions. Like a loose baffle or rodent nests from while in storage.
Make sure the air cleaner is clean and not overoiled.
I'm not familiar with the Web 940, but suspect it's not quite a race cam, but mid to upper power band. You would want at least 12:1 to 14:1 compression and 100 or more octane. You didn't say what brand and compression your piston is. A 11:1 piston may act like a dog at the bottom end, but go faster at mid and especially top end. More compression may bring back dome bottom end.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Thanks for the reply, everything is good and it runs and idles perfectly fine. I just don't feel a noticeable power gain and the fuel supply had to go way way way down.
It's a hmf exhaust. 11:1 weisco piston. And it's the webcam 340/942, sorry. Lift valve . 445/.397, duration 275/275,
Timing is good, and air cleaner is brand new as well (pro design)

CT didn't really polish the head either. Looks like they hogged it out with a large end mill and called it good.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
No dynos near me either, stock bore piston. It feels about the same as it did before the head work. Nothing wrong with it as far as performance. It runs clean, the plug looks good. I just don't understand why it would need half the fuel it did before and why I don't feel a power gain.
 

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Did you adjust on the "I" or the "T" marks?
Recheck your valve adjustment per cam instructions. With a cold motor.
Readjust your TPS using your PC5 software.
Look in the exhaust with a flashlight and run a semiflexible wire thru to the head feeling for obstructions. Like a loose baffle or rodent nests from while in storage.
Make sure the 'new' air cleaner is clean and not over oiled.
You would want at least 12:1 to 14:1 compression and 100 or more octane. A 11:1 piston may act like a dog at the bottom end, but go faster at mid and especially top end. More compression may bring back some bottom end.
The revised list above still should be checked. Especially the TPS and exhaust.
Is this collection of parts a build recommendation by CT? Mismatched parts won't reach the full potential.
I think your 11:1 compression and exhaust are holding you back. Or the exhaust is plugged.
You might put your Stage 3 in and see if it helps since it may compliment your compression better.

"Port and polish" isn't really what it sounds like. You want the intake side to have a rough texture to keep the fuel turbulating as well as atomized. Now, the exhaust ports want to be smooth to mirror polished to prevent carbon build up.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
What do you mean by I and The marks? I set it how I normally do with them lined up like stock. The valves were set by CT, I did check them when I put it together. All the head work was done by CT (cam, valves, porting) they recommend the +3 TB so I purchased that through curveo (probably misspelled). Everything else was already there.

Another thing I noticed, it seems like it turns over a lot easier now. It used to struggle a bit when cold and it doesn't anymore, it turns over like it did when it was stock/new.
 

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Timing marks are "T" for top dead center, (TDC), and "I" for ignition on the flywheel. Your manual will explain how to set it.
What were the valve set at?
It may crank over slower when the rings are seating, or faster depending on battery charge.
Did you check ring gap?
Did you hone the cylinder?
Speaking of ring seating, start it and looks for leaks, then turn off for cool down. Next time you start it, be ready to ride for 1/2 hour. Ride aggressively without lugging. and don't let it idle any more then needed. Otherwise the rings may not seat proper, affecting performance. After cool down it's ready to 'ride it like you stole it'.
Cuervo TB's used to be done by Racers Edge, probably still are and are top quality.
You didn't say you adjusted the TPS???? Are you checking anything I'm suggesting?
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Yes sir, I checked all that. I didn't even take the cylinder off just the head, yes the TPS was set manually with a multi meter then I used the power commander. The timing is set perfect.
All this work was done a few months ago and I've rode it quite a bit.
Am I crazy for thinking I should have had to increase the fuel amount? I asked CT about it and they just said it runs more efficiently now. But it's dam near running on the stock fuel map.
It's not like it's low on power, it's still pretty fast but I didn't notice a big, if any power gain. From all the head work.
 

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Have you tried like drag racing down a long stretch and wind it out? Maybe the power band of the cam is set for higher rpms than just normal farting around. A high rpm cam can feel sluggish at lower rpms then when it hits its power band, away it goes
 

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Have you tried like drag racing down a long stretch and wind it out? Maybe the power band of the cam is set for higher rpms than just normal farting around. A high rpm cam can feel sluggish at lower rpms then when it hits its power band, away it goes
I agree, thats what i was saying earlier with a big cam and needing more compression then 11:1. He may like it better with the Stage 3 put back in.
 

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Am I crazy for thinking I should have had to increase the fuel amount? I asked CT about it and they just said it runs more efficiently now. But it's dam near running on the stock fuel map.
It's not like it's low on power, it's still pretty fast but I didn't notice a big, if any power gain. From all the head work.
Porting and cam don't affect the air fuel ratio. Only the intake and exhaust. As far as the motor knows you changed the TB to bigger than stock and the map change would change very little.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Yeah, I had to change the fuel map drastically to make it run right. I would love to change to a bigger compression piston but they don't sell anything over 93 octane around me.
Yeah I have opened it up a bunch but don't notice any added power. Feels about the same as it did before. Only difference now is it probably gets better gas mileage lol.
CT recommended that cam as their "all around" Cam.
 

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Ask CT, or look at your paperwork what the RPM range is for the cam. I bet it's mid to upper range.
If you have time, put the Stage 3 in and see what it will do.
I think your exhaust is holding you back.
Monster or Barkers might work better, but may not be practical.
You might go on the Dynojet site and look for a map with +3 TB and A/M exhaust.
What's your elevation?
It's hard to spend al that money and not see a big improvement.
 

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Looking at that cam from their website, it is a mid to upper range type of cam. Is your HMF a full exhaust I assume? I don’t know much about that style of exhaust other than they are annoyingly loud, lol. It is easy enough to just swap cams to do a same day feel to see what just that difference is in the terrain you ride in.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Yes, it frustrating to spend that much and see a difference. I agree, the exhaust is probably holding back performance but I should at least see some improvement and not have to cut the fuel map in half. I have tried to download a few different maps and curveo sent me a couple for my mods and they were all WAY to rich.
640' elevation.
Hfm is annoyingly loud lol and yes it's a full system.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
I kind of feel like they messed something up with the porting. I could be wrong but that's how it feels. CT sent me maps too and they were also way too rich.
 

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I kind of feel like they messed something up with the porting. I could be wrong but that's how it feels. CT sent me maps too and they were also way too rich.
It's easy to mess up the porting. I've had Cuervo porting and always recommend him over some backyard porter. I know CT isn't backyard but Cuervo only works on raptors.
 

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What were the valves set at?
You didn't say what the valves were set at? Performance cams are usually tighter then factory cams. Be sure you are using the correct feeler gauge to match the spec's. Meaning SAE, gauge for SAE spec's, or metric gauge for metric spec's.
You might do a compression check. A new top end on a worn bottom won't reach it's potential.
 
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